Flying High: Joys of Aviation & Writing with Jack Stewart

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (00:02.048)
and welcome to the Thriller Zone. I'm your host David Temple.

And on today's 206th episode, I'm happy to welcome back for a return face-to-face visit here in our home studios of the Thriller Zone in San Diego, my good friend and one of your favorite authors, Jack Stewart. On today's show, Jack and I spend a good deal of time, given we're hanging out and breathing the same air, to the craft of writing, specifically thrillers, and in Jack's case, military thrillers. Jack is now knee deep in book three of the Battleborn thriller series with his newest, Bogie Spades.

up close and personal conversations that lean a bit more languorous than most social media feeds these days. You'll enjoy today's show. Today we discuss Top Gun Maverick, what it's like to fly both fighter jets and commercial airlines, the world of special forces, along with the grueling training, and a whole lot more. So let's get to it with Jack Stewart right here on The Thriller Zone. Last time we chatted, by the way, welcome to The Thriller Zone. Jack Stewart. you. Hey, happy to be here.

Handsome devil. Yes, beast devil. We talked last time about how busy you were. Yeah. And I'm wondering how much of that busyness are you happy to share? Cause I was, we had brunch down at Ocean Beach. Yeah, Ocean Beach. And when you told me what your schedule was like, I'm like, you are kidding me, right?

Yeah, I wish I was sometimes. Sometimes I think I bit off more than I can chew, but I'm really enjoying it. So I just want to keep, you know, keep striking with the iron's hot. Yeah. So, you know, I think everyone knows that, you know, Battleborn series right now is a four book series and, bogey spades is the third book in that series. The fourth one declared hostile is available for preorder on Amazon. Now that one's going to be next August. that will come out next August. and I'm also excited, you know, to, to be.

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (02:01.198)
begin a new series with Tyndale. That one's a three book series and the first book will come out in May of 2025. And then I think one year, one book every year after that. Now, Tyndale, if I'm not mistaken, is a, has been traditionally a faith-based group because my dad was in the ministry. So I remember hearing that publisher many years back, but let's see, I'm thinking of Andrews Wilson. They were with them for a while.

Ryan Steck. Yes, he has several books with them in the Matthew Red series. But this book that's through Tendil is not what you'd call faith-based. And when I say faith-based, having grown up in the church, that always means kind of religious. But that doesn't have to be the case, right? Yeah, and that's something that, so, you know, Karen Watson...

she had this kind of vision for men's fiction and to minister to men through fiction, which I think is a really cool thing. and so they weren't looking for specifically books that are beachy over the head, you know, Christian themed, but still something that number one doesn't turn off a Christian reader, but number two, maybe inspires and delivers a message of hope, which

You know, I'm co-writing that series with a guy named Chad Robichaud. He's an incredible human being. And, you know, if you haven't looked him up, you need to. He does amazing things. But one of the things that he does is he ministers to a lot of our military on the issues of resilience, spiritual resilience primarily. But we wanted to write this series as a way of kind of reaching out to people who experienced some of the same things that we have in our military careers.

And, at least expose them to the idea of that. is some hope out there. So, so our character, this guy named Foster Quinn, it kind of mirrors Chad's career a little bit. was a forced recon Marine, and, and Foster deals with a lot of PTSD issues, as a series series progresses. and, and we, don't want it to be like, but PTSD is no big deal because I'm a believer. No, we wanted him to really question his faith and,

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (04:19.288)
kind of experienced what a lot of us have experienced in the military, is, I'm in the trenches. you know, I got more rounds coming in. got incoming enemy fire. Maybe I don't necessarily believe all this stuff. I believe every Sunday when I went to church as a kid, you know, maybe I have doubts. so, so I think Karen and the team there at Tyndale really appreciate that this is kind of a way of opening up that discussion, you know? So I think.

Whether you're a Christian reader, I think you'll enjoy it because you'll find elements of faith in there. But if you're not Christian reader, you might also enjoy it. And so that's our hope. When I was reading, to refer back to Andrews Wilson, when I was reading one of their books and I knew it was through Tyndale, it wasn't, again, like you say, it wasn't over the top, it hit you over the head. It was just kind of a, just an added element of the story. And I appreciated that because when I first heard about this opportunity, I was like,

Jesus, this is going to be a banger of the head count. I have a couple of things that I want to geek out on, on my own personal, just things that I have. I don't think I've ever asked you and I, because it's my show and I can do whatever I want. thought I take this opportunity and a couple of them are going to be, they're going to seem, they may seem silly to you because you may be like, really? You don't know what that means, but I can.

I can declare my ignorance in advance and be okay. So you were a top gun flyer pilot. Sorry. See, I use the wrong word right there. How much of like, for instance, maverick, how much of the movie that I saw is kind of what you lived in your life? Well, so

both movies, the original and then Top Gun Maverick. You know, it's all, it's all based on the school Top Gun and, neither movie is very accurate when it, when it comes to what Top Gun really is. really? Yeah. It's not a competition. You're not angling to be the best, you know, fighter pilot in your class or anything. There's no, there's no plaque, you know, for the alternates in the ladies room. There's no trophy. There's none of that stuff. what it is is a, is a very,

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (06:34.039)
regimented training program to take pilots who are already pretty proficient in the airplane and teach them how to be tactics instructors so that they can go back to the fleet, to the other squadrons and teach guys how to do those missions. So for Top Gun Maverick, let's say, they're not going to take a bunch of Top Gun graduates from all over the fleet and bring them together for this mission because theoretically,

Those guys are out there teaching everyone else in their air wing how to be just as proficient and just as tactical. so it just wouldn't happen that way. But that being said, I think the, there is still a natural tendency to want to compete against your peers and be the best. And so I think they kind of reflect that in the movie. And that's pretty good. The bantering that goes on between, you know, fighter pilots, that's pretty common, pretty, pretty accurate.

The flying scenes themselves were very, good. I mean, the tactics probably are not accurate, but who cares? It was a fun movie. Right. Yeah. I remember hearing in an interview, Tom Cruise was talking about, he wanted the experience to be as real for the viewer as possible. so much of that filming was, wasn't, he wasn't in a studio on a green screen. He was literally in the jet. He may not have been flying.

because he was probably in the... He was in the back. Yeah. In the back. But, you know, guy sitting at home doesn't know that. But, you know, the one thing I've always admired about Tom is he does so much of his own... Yeah. Yeah. And I know that I saw some interviews and he was saying he wanted every single one of the actors to be experiencing that as well. So they all got to fly in the jets. They got to experience the G-forces. They got to...

feel what it's like wearing all that gear while, you know, pulling G's. There's another question I've always wondered. You have on a pretty fair amount of gear. Yeah. And gear meaning you've got the flight suit, but then you have different kinds of breathing apparatuses, right? Yeah. But do you have some kind of a thing that puts pressure on your legs so that- Yeah.

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (08:47.082)
Explain it to me. So, so it's called a G suit or technically an anti G suit and, it, look like chaps. So they, they, they pull on over your legs. there's, you know, zippers on both sides and it kind of, there's a cummerbund that kind of goes around your, your midsection. and, it has these air bladders that connect. There's a hose that connects to the aircraft itself. So as you pull Gs, the, the jet forces air into the suit.

inflates these bladders to put, to constrict basically, you know, your legs and your abdomen so that it keeps the blood from pooling in your lower extremities. So as you're pulling G's, the G forces are causing the blood to go from your brain down your body and, you know, pool in your, basically your feet to the bottom. And so if you do that, where you lose blood in your brain, you black out. can't see, and then you could completely pass out.

It's called G induced loss of consciousness. And, and that's not a good thing when you're flying a really expensive jet, you know, and really fast close to the ground. So they, you wear this G suit, it forces the blood back up and it only provides, I think one to two G's of protection. So it's not much. You still have to do some straining yourself. I'm still flexing all your muscles and, and, and forcing it and then breathing a certain way to kind of keep that pressure on it. Yeah. But you had to have passed out at some time in your training.

No, I haven't. No, they put you through what they call the centrifuge training. And it's a thing that just spins. they spin it so fast that the centrifugal forces makes you feel the G-forces. And they do it and they record you. So get a camera right in your face and you get to watch your cheeks start to droop. So you look like a...

you know, 65 year old man when you're, you know, 18, 19, 20 years old, whenever you go through the training. and a lot of people do pass out. And a lot of people, you know, it's very, very common. I didn't, but it was very uncomfortable. I did not enjoy it. Yeah. So it would suffice to say that if you had challenges with vertigo, that might not be the career for you. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You probably have to have some pretty strong inner ear, you know, to, handle this. Yeah.

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (11:03.636)
And perfect vision, right? Isn't that true? Initially, when I got, when I started pilot training, you had to have 2020 uncorrected vision. You weren't allowed to have Lasik. I think now you can have Lasik surgery as long as it's 2020. But then as you, once you finished training, then the standards change. You can, you know, wear glasses if you need to. Yeah. If you hadn't have gone in, gone into this career, what other careers were you thinking about when you were?

So at one point in my life, I wanted to be a Disney animator. I love drawing. Really? I used to draw Disney characters like Little Mermaid. I think to this day, I can still draw Mickey Mouse pretty well. But that was one of my dreams as a kid. But honestly, when I found the Naval Academy when I was like eight years old and was pretty focused on that, I, you

grew up in an aviation household. dad was a pilot. My mom's dad flew B-17s in World War II. So aviation was always been in my blood. And at some point, I was a runner and a swimmer in high school. So I thought maybe I'll be a Navy SEAL. This is right after Desert Storm. And I thought I was really fascinated with special operations. so you hear the stories of Jack Carr and how he discovered the SEALs. I mean, discovered them the same way. He just stuck it out. And I just said, that's too hard. I'm not going to do that.

But yes, I went to the Naval Academy thinking maybe I'd do that. You know, I, I kind of waffle a little bit on what I was going to do. At some point I had decided I was going to be a Marine. and I was part of the, the, Leatherneck, or the Semper Fi society. And I did Leatherneck training, as a midshipman went to Quantico for a month, did some stuff with the Marine Corps for summer training. And then I came back from that. I had a great time. It was like Boy Scout camp for adults.

and shot a lot of guns and blew stuff up and marched around the woods and loved it, but decided I didn't want to do that. So I went back to my first love of aviation and decided to just be a pilot. So if I didn't go in the military, I don't honestly don't know what I would have done. I really don't. Disney animator. That's something I never knew about you. I had no idea you had that artistic talent. Yeah. Well, I mean, it's debatable whether it's talent or not, but I did, did used to draw a lot. don't much anymore.

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (13:26.71)
You know, I'm going to have to pull out a pad and see what kind of goods you got. Back to the Navy SEALs. That is as tough as everything you ever hear, right? I mean, there is no, there is no, we're going to let you go on this one. We're going to let you slide. There is none of that. Yeah. I mean, I do think that, you know, after 9-11 and the demand for special operations forces really increased, they started, I think there was a

a greater need for numbers. And so I don't, I don't, I don't want to say that the standards were lower. I don't think that's the case because I, I served with them, you know, down range and I do think that they're all, they are all very professional. Of course, in any group you've got some that, that make it through that probably don't deserve it. But, but it's not what it was like in the nineties, you know, in the, in, in the nineties, I think it was such a small force. wasn't well publicized, you know,

And so I think they could choose to be more exclusive. now that the numbers are up and so you got a lot more people trying out for it. I know I probably last like a day maybe, a day and a half tops. Really? I think so. Have you ever talked to the other Jack about what it was like?

Yeah, I mean, briefly. Yeah. Briefly. mean, you know, I have that much respect for any of those guys who've done any of that kind of training, whether it be SEAL training, whether it be, you know, the special forces, you know, qualification course, you know, Fort Bragg for the army, green braids, whether it be the, you know, Marine force recon types, the Marine Raiders, mean, and the special operations guys, the things that they go through, I think is just, you know, for, for training alone is challenging. You know,

I should know this because I watch enough television and films. A little bit of a joke there. But what is the very tip top of that fraternity? So the Joint Special Operations Command is the command that has all the Tier 1 special operations units. So like the 75th Ranger Regiment, Army's Delta Force, Seal Team Six, those are all.

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (15:38.04)
They're the 24th STS, which is the special tactic squadron for the air force that provides the combat controllers and, and, and J tax the guys that call on air strikes for those units. mean, that's so J SOC is the tier one. that's, that's the very tip top. and the thing about those units is that they, you know, they will do cross training and they will do cross assignments. So like, let's say a Navy SEAL can go to Delta force, you know, and, and, deploy with them.

and vice versa. That's the top top, you know, and then from on down, then you, we like to say that that's like the dark side of special operations, you know, it's the top secret, know, it was supposed to be hush hush until, you know, former presidents came out and said that SEAL Team Six got bin Laden and then it was not so top secret anymore. But yeah, and then you've got just the

You know, don't want to say just the, the SEAL teams are just the Green Beret ODAs or whatever, because those, those guys are all tough too. Yeah. What is the movie I'm thinking of? geez, the guy from the office. you're talking about 13 hours? Yes. I was going, there's a number, number, number 13 hours. I don't know how many times Tammy and I have sat down. 13 hours is one of those movies that we may have already seen it last weekend.

And if we're grabbing lunch or something and all of sudden it's on, we'll stop and we'll watch it again. Even if it's midstream. I don't know what it is about that film or a lot of these different action war oriented films that we're so enamored with. Yes, it's great acting. And it is a piece of history that we're all familiar with, but it's just pure entertainment. I want to get to Bogie Spades, which by the way,

love the cover. Whoever's put your Battleborn thriller series together really has got the branding down. Yeah, Seven Rivers, they've done a really good job with all the covers. mean, they're fantastic. This book starts out at a nice little slow simmer. I'm reading the first, I'm like, that's interesting. And then it turns a page and the simmer up, the simmer increased a little bit. Yeah. Drill down and tell me in a nutshell,

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (18:03.81)
what the book's about and also how we pick up from where we left off. Yeah. So, it doesn't really quite exactly pick up where outlaw, which is the second book in the series leaves off. It kind of goes back a little bit to an unanswered question from book one. in, in book one, there was a,

trying to see if I can give this away or talk about it without giving it away for those who haven't read it yet. So that's why I'm leaving it to Yeah, I know. there's somebody who's a traitor in the military and you learn who that traitor is in book one in Unknown Rider, but there's no real-world solution because the good guys haven't discovered that person's identity yet. What you do discover is that there is a

bigger conspiracy involving the Chinese than that you, they don't really know about beforehand. So pick up now the beginning of bogey spades that traders back. Yeah. And not only is that trader back, but he ends up being captured by an unknown third party. So what, what's going on here? Who, who's the real enemy? And then

it forces, like I like to say, you know, is the enemy of my enemy, my friend. and that's kind of the situation that Emmy King, who's the NCIS counter intelligence agent in this book, what she is forced to ask because the person that she's been searching for, the person that she's been hunting all along comes to her and says, I need your help. And so, so there ends up being a lot of questions about, now who really is the bad guy? and you know, for people who know about.

tactical aviation, the titles of my books have meaning behind it. so bogey spades is, if I'm running an intercept on another aircraft and I don't know whether they are friend or foe, they're referred to as a bogey, a bogey is an unknown, but spades, means that they are not squawking a friendly code. So when you take off in any airplane, you'll have a transponder and that code allows air traffic control.

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (20:18.656)
know who it is. we have something called mode four in our aircraft that when we're flying overseas, another friendly aircraft or like an AWACS or somebody can interrogate you and say, okay, that's definitely a friendly cause it's got this friendly code. So bogey spades means we don't know if they're good guy or bad guy, but we know for a fact, they're not squawking or friendly code. So what that means in terms of this book and the theme is

We don't really know who the good guy or bad guy is. I love that. I didn't get that parallel. Cause you always hear in movies and cetera, we've got a bogey on your. Yeah. Well, you wouldn't say on your right side, there's a, your phrase would be. Yeah. Well, we would say like three o'clock if it's three o'clock. Yeah. would be a, yeah. You got me the book. Very first thing I'm like, I wonder who bogey spades is. And I thought it was a, you know, like rattle off some of the names of the characters in Top Gun. Yeah. Yeah.

And I thought, Maggis Man and all that, yeah. I thought it was, there's a guy named Bogey Spades. Yeah. So, want to drill down on your process because we had brunch a couple of weeks ago. And I was in, you know, I'm going to refer to this constantly because I'm, well, first I'm a huge admirer yours and you're such a good dude. Tammy and I were talking last night. She goes, when Jack gets in, I'm like, you know, such and such. And she goes, he's such a nice guy. I'm like, he's such a good dude.

just solid dude. Yeah, thanks man. Yeah. But I want to drill down on technique because that's what I was so impressed with because you're, you know, us writers, go, I've got a book I've got to create. Okay. One off. I might have a series going to be two or three. I might go do a collaboration with someone. Now you're in an entirely different world.

Hey, I may go right for a franchise system. That would be another one. And I just wonder, A, kind of how you keep it all straight. that may sound elementary, but what I'm trying to get at is having written a couple of different series, know, once you immerse yourself in a series, you know, the people, you know, the world, you know, how they're banter.

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (22:40.014)
their techniques, their secrets. Then you move into another one and you go, you don't want to cross pollinate them because you don't want to duplicate because that's lazy and. Yeah. So kind of how do you, how do you keep those worlds? You know that? it's a really good question. Like one thing that I, I do, I only write one book at a time. so for instance, when I was writing Bogey Spades, I was focused on writing Bogey Spades. I wasn't, I wasn't focused on.

you know, one of my Tyndale books or another project. And then if I have another book that's in the editorial process and I get notes back from the editor, then I will take, for instance, Bogie Spades, set it aside. And then I will kind of take some time to immerse myself back into that world for the other series, do what needs to be done on it for the editing process, send it back to the editor and then go back and pick up Bogie Spades and take some time to get re-immersed back in that world.

and then continue. I'm sure there is still some cross pollination. There's a project I'm working on now that I can't talk about yet, but, but there's a few times where I was like, wait, did I say Colt in that one? And I got to do a little word search to make sure I didn't accidentally type Colt, you know? and they're different characters. So it's, you know, I wouldn't think that I would, but you do have that kind of doubt sometimes. but, yeah, as far as, know,

Each, like for instance, this series, the Battleborn series versus the Silent Horizon series that I have with Tyndale and Chad, I see them as different movies. And so in my head, I'm watching a movie. So I press pause when I need to step aside and then I just go back and press play. And maybe if I've forgotten a little bit, I'll rewind two or three minutes and press play again. So I get a chance to see it in my head.

What do you love to watch in your downtime? let's use this. So maybe the wife and the kids are off shopping or whatever, and it's just you and hanging out at home on a weekend. What do you find yourself reaching the remote for? Man, that's a really good question. It depends on how much time I have. Like if it's like, you know, just lunchtime, you know, and I just gonna watch something while I'm eating lunch, I'll turn on the news.

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (25:05.4)
Uh-huh. That's literally the only time I watch the news. As soon as I'm done eating, I turn it off. I don't want to listen to any more negativity and then just go back to my world, you know? but if it's, if I want to shut down my brain and not think about my projects that I'm working on, that's what I'm getting at. Yeah. I will, you know, I, I typically will watch, a series, you know, I enjoy watching, like for instance, Vikings. I enjoy watching, rings of power on Amazon, you know, some fantasy, you know, some historical stuff.

I think the, Bosch series, you know, and the Lincoln lawyer series, those Michael Connelly ones are fantastic. I'll watch those. Honestly, anything that has a compelling story I can find entertainment in. I'm not specific to one genre or the other. I like kind of along the same lines, like things that I read for entertainment.

I will, I would try to read things that are outside of the genre because I will read my friends books when they come out, you know, to support them because I like their reading. and they're all very talented, but I like to step out of that and like to read some science fiction, like to read some fantasy, and other things. And it's interesting that you'd mentioned fantasy because I was going to ask you, do you ever find yourself wanting to branch out and write in an entirely different genre like sci-fi or fantasy or even romance something?

Yeah, I think I would. I mean, I don't think that as a writer, think as a writer, you're a storyteller period. doesn't really matter what genre you write in. think maybe back in, you know, the eighties, even earlier, it was probably very important for writers to kind of be known as okay, Tom Clancy is this guy, know, Stephen King is this guy. But in today's

day and age when you have limitless technology to reach out to readers, you don't have to be pigeonholed into that one specific genre. I'm sure people will argue with me and say that it doesn't make sense from a sales standpoint, from a business standpoint to branch out, but we're all creatives to one degree or another. if you have a story to tell that doesn't fit into what you've been writing, I think you should write it. And I do have some ideas in the back of my head.

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (27:24.832)
I love hearing that because we have had this conversation before and I've had this conversation with a number of people, especially when it comes to that phrase of write what you know. And sometimes I'm like, if you're just, if you're a solid storyteller and Lee Goldberg and I were talking about this on a show a couple of weeks ago and he, and we were talking about how I was having this conversation with a Hollywood producer and he was inferring the fact that, you should write what you know. And, and Lee very quickly said,

Well, I've never been a detective or a fireman or a policeman or a circus clown. So that's why it's called a creative who has imagination. And I'm always a fan of people who go, you know, I got a story to tell. If one day you wanted to sit down, I want to crank out a romcom. I know you could do it. So to that point, writing is writing. I mean, how many of these people,

you know, I've ever been a serial killer, you know, like they haven't, but in their mind they can put themselves into that serial killers mindset and they can create this character that the reader believes is really that evil. like, yeah, like to your point, you don't have to have lived it to understand human emotion. Right. You know, we all have our, our emotions and, and how you react to things and you can project yourself into how you would feel in that situation. And it doesn't matter whether it's.

Like you said, whether you're in a police cruiser, whether you're on a ship, whether you're in the sky, it doesn't really matter. You know, for those folks who I'm sure everyone knows that you are an airplane pilot now for Southwest Airlines. Do you, do you ever find yourself using your day to day knowledge and expertise in your writing? I think the

greatest part about my job and I think the way I use it for research, number one, obviously the locations. If I'm writing a book that takes place in San Diego, I can come to San Diego. The project I'm working on, there's a part that takes place in San Antonio. So I hopped on a plane and flew down to San Antonio and spent the day there just looking up what I needed to look up. So that part is great.

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (29:39.938)
I interact with a lot of people, know, not only the person sitting next to me in the cockpit, but I've got the flight attendants in the back, passengers. And you know, some of the best people watching in the world is at an airport. And I am in so many airports. I see so many things and it really just gets you thinking about, you know, different character traits that you can employ in stories. So, and I don't think, I mean, they're

could come a time, know, know TJ Newman is fantastic about, you know, writing about commercial aviation, kind of the scary parts about it. But the thing I love most about her first book, Falling, is that she has the interaction between these flight attendants and they were so believable. I've flown with those flight attendants, you know what I mean? Like those people are recognized and that's something that she could bring to that story.

That is a thing I think if I was going to bring anything to a story from my day-to-day job, it's going to be the people, the characters. It's funny that you should bring her up because I was just thinking about her right before you said it. And I was thinking, that's one of the beauties of her first book. then with drowning her second book, it was even more palpable and getting, putting her characters in really volatile situations.

You know, our only access to flight attendants is getting served by them, generally speaking, and they do a fantastic job. One thing I did not know, and you're gonna, somebody's gonna think I'm a ignoramus, but I did not know that they were trained to the degree that they're trained. You know, I'm embarrassed to admit that I always thought they were basically a...

Waitress in the sky. Waitress in the sky. And that sounds so demeaning. And I don't mean it that way. having read her work and then talked to her now three times, she goes, no, we're trained to a serious degree. Yeah. that's, you know, that's one thing.

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (31:49.996)
And again, you wouldn't know that, right? mean, your day to day, if you are going to be flying on an airplane and they come by and they ask you what your drink order is, you give it to them, that's your interaction with them. That's what you expect. But I do work with them. I do see the training they go through. I do know how professional they are and how difficult it is. I know that movie about Soli.

landing the plane on the Hudson. yeah, yeah, yeah. I watched that movie and there was that scene where the flight attendants are, you know, yelling heads down, stay down as we're getting ready to land in the water. And I got chills because I'm like, that's a profession that I'm proud of. know, the, the, the everybody, you know, from myself up as the captain to my first officer, to my flight attendants, our number one responsibility is to get you and your family where you need to go safely. That's it. Like, I'm sorry if you

Don't get your drink. If it's bumpy and unsafe, then we're just going to worry about safety first. And so I'm really proud of that. And yeah, and I wouldn't expect everyone to know it either. I have such an admiration for pilots. Every single time I fly and as I'm walking down the aisle, I always have this urge to go, thank you. Thank you for getting me here safely. Cause I realized that our lives are in your hands.

And sometimes they'll leave the door open. And when I see the pilot come out, I'll go, thank you so much. And it's so interesting to go and see them acknowledge. go, well, of course. So big props to you for that. Yeah, thank you. What's one of the things that you, and you're a pretty, you're a very grounded, solid, even keeled guy. I've never seen you sweat. I've never seen you.

get nervous, but what is something that happens when you get on a plane? What is something that goes through your mind that you're always, you're like, okay, that you're always aware of? Maybe you're silently afraid of, you, you go, Ooh, this is something I want to keep top of mind. Honestly. Or is it just another day at the office? You know, I don't want to say it's cavalier in the sense that I don't worry about stuff, you know, I,

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (34:11.83)
I'm obviously, you know, if I'm flying somewhere, for instance, flying here to San Diego last night, and then there was, there was some low ceilings and, because of it, there were the approach that we use coming to San Diego. Normally you fly, landing to the West. So you land a runway two seven, but those approaches don't get you low enough for the ceilings that we had here. And so we had to land runway nine. So that's not, I've done it twice, you know, in

how many years have I been flying and how many times have I landed in San Diego. So that was unusual. So that raises the pressure a little bit because I'm not as familiar with that approach. I'm not as familiar with that it's not routine. And then obviously as the weather is a little bit worse, you're raising your level of awareness a little bit more. I don't want to say it doesn't make me scared. It doesn't make me nervous. I mean, I'm feel very comfortable doing it. Had no problems at all last night, but I just can't.

be as relaxed as I normally am. So if something's out of the ordinary, that's when we'll start to kind of put a little bit more emphasis on paying attention to what we're doing. All right. For those who don't know ceiling is cloud cover. So if the ceiling is low, the clouds are low, makes it harder to land. Cause you, don't get visibility until much later in the flight. Yeah. So for instance, the approaches

coming from the east of landing to the west. think the, the minimum altitude that you can fly those approaches to is about 700 feet. and the cloud cover here in San Diego, the last couple of days is varied, you know, between 300 to 500 feet. So that means if we were to fly one of those approaches, we would still be in the clouds or trying and, we couldn't go any lower. So we'd have to do a missed approach, go around.

But if we land at the other, from the other direction from the West, those approaches can get you down to 200 feet. And so you get below the clouds and then you can see the runway and it's right there and it's beautiful and you land. One of the things that as I continue to geek out over my home city here of San Diego, that they love is when you're coming in on San Diego, you're right, what feels like you're on the top of all these buildings.

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (36:30.796)
And you can sit downtown at any given moment, look up and you're just, can see in the windows. guys are landing so close. Yeah, it's really cool. Not a lot of cities do that. Yeah, I there's, there's very few. know there's a, probably my favorite approaches to fly are here in San Diego for that reason, cause you do fly right by downtown, which is pretty cool. I like flying into Reagan national in Washington, DC, especially coming from the North cause you follow the,

the Potomac River and you just right down your left side, you can look out and you can see the National Mall, you can see the White House, you can see the Capitol building, you can see everything. And we have to stay over the water of the river or to the west, because if you go on the other side, you enter prohibited airspace and there's lights that'll warn you, like, don't go this way because we could shoot you down kind of thing.

but that's a really fun approach to fly. And then also going into LaGuardia in New York. yeah. Because a lot of times they'll take us right up the Hudson and he'll just fly right by Manhattan. It's a really cool view. What is something that happens on a daily basis or happens when you're flying? I've always wondered this. What is something that the general audience doesn't know? 99 % of us will never get to go into a cockpit.

And I find that, first of all, part of this geeking out is I love to fly. I've always loved to fly. I like anything to do with elevation. I started all my pilots, private pilots, haven't gotten through it. It's very expensive hobby, very expensive. I'm always fascinated about what goes inside that room. Not only is it a world that again, 99 % of us, 99.9 will never see. I think of all the buttons and knowing.

I mean, yeah. think the biggest misconception people have is with turbulence. You know, if you're a passenger, think your assumption is that the pilots know when turbulence is going to happen. They know how to avoid it. They, and that's just simply not true. Like how would you know it? Yeah. would be, know, either certain clouds that if I fly into, I'm like, I'm pretty sure it's going be bumpy, but then sometimes they're not, you know, so we, just use our experience to judge, but

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (38:47.458)
but people don't really understand what turbulence is. They, they worry a lot about it. Like, you know, they worry if it's really bumpy, that that's somehow unsafe. And that's so not true. that I wish I could get more of the word out to people like, it's going to be bumping, it's totally, none of us are worried. Like we're upfront, just kind of bouncing around and not even thinking about it. But the fact of the matter is, I try to explain it like this.

If you were to jump into a river, there's parts of the river that are fast flowing. There's parts that are slow. There's parts that, you know, it maybe turns right, turns left. You can't necessarily see it. Sometimes you can, but sometimes you can't. And that's what's happening in the air. There's currents, you know, they're moving left, right, up, down. And unless there's cloud formations that are being affected by it, you would never know. We call it clear air turbulence. And so we do our

best to guess based on meteorological conditions. But we have a new application that we use at Southwest now. You can put in your route of flight and then it uses other airplanes who are also connected to the same server that sort of report like Waze does turbulence. if their iPad measures a certain jostle, it say, this is light turbulence. And they'll put a little color, a yellow color on the screen.

If it's harder, it's maybe a moderate turbulence. So it'll put an orange color on there. And so everyone else that's flying can see that. And so that's what we're using now to try to predict it. But even sometimes I'll fly through it and I'm like, there was nothing there. So we do our best to find the better rides, to talk to each other and find out, hey, how's this else dude? that one's reported smooth. Okay, we want to go there. So if you're flying at 30 and it's rough, you could go to...

35 or 40. Yeah, you can go up, you can go down. It all depends on, if you go down, you're going to burn more gas. You got to make sure you have the gas for it. You know, Cause thinner air is just the way jet engines work. Jet engines when you're at lower altitude, you know, they're, they're less efficient. Yeah. Cause the density of the air and yeah, there's so much we're learning today. Isn't there, isn't that fascinating? we now know of your far past and your

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (41:07.702)
current situation being a pilot. Do you, how, and I think I asked you this at brunch the other day, how long do you think you have left before you can say, I'm ready full time? Well, that's a really good question. know, Ward Larson, who's a good friend of mine is also a pilot. He's a captain at Southwest airlines and he is far more,

experienced in writing than I am. He has so many books published right now and he's still doing the job. And I mentioned it to him one time and I was like, you know, Ward, I think I want to do this for five more years and then retire. And you know, if I'm successful enough, that's going to work. And he's like, you're not going to want to retire. I'm like, I'm not. And he showed me his schedule and his seniority, he gets the two day trip to Aruba and then, you know, gives away the rest of his trips. So I'm like, okay, you're right. I can do that.

My seniority is pretty low where I am in Dallas and that means that I get, you know, weekends, three day trips, reserve. I probably work every holiday for the foreseeable future. So it's a little bit hard for me to see that way. The good news is for a rider being a pilot is probably the best professional in the world. You know, I'll have overnights in hotels like this morning before I came here, I sat on my balcony at the Marina.

and looked out over the water and I can do some writing there. I have a cup of coffee. I don't have kids bothering me at home. so it is a really good job. So right now I'm able to juggle both. I don't know how long I wanna do it, but I'm sorry if somebody's gonna offer me a million dollars a year to write a book, I'll probably think about retiring. You're on your way. Yeah, I hope. Which do your kids think is the-

Cooler dad is a pilot or dead is a world recognized author. Yeah, definitely. They probably think pilot. Yeah. Yeah. They honestly don't care that I write books. mean, they probably think it's cool, but they're like, whatever. Have they read your work? No, no. In fact, my oldest, my oldest son, he said, dad, I'm going to, I'm going to read your book. I'm like, well, I really appreciate that. Thank you. And so two days later I'm like, how's it going? He's like, well, I put it aside. I'm like,

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (43:29.366)
He didn't, didn't read it. He's like, no, I'm excited to read the Bible instead. And I thought, can't really be upset at that. Number one, that's probably a, you know, much more wholesome book to read than mine. but also it's the number one bestselling book in the history of the world. Yeah. So I'm hoping that he picks it up after he finishes the Bible. Yeah.

And this makes me think of, often, this is a question I had back in the day and I think I'm gonna start bringing it back. I like to know what are on my author's nightstands. And I use that metaphorically, TBR stand to be read, nightstands, your office stand, whatever, what's a book or two that you have set aside for yourself that is not something you're working on, is not one of your pals books that maybe you're reading to blurb.

but just something you're like, I want to carve out some time for me and just sit down and get lost in this book. Right now I'm reading a fantasy novel. The author is a well-known thriller author who has this relatively successful series in fantasy. Who is it? Trying to remember. I can't think of the name. Man or woman? Man.

Anyway, you're reading. Yeah, so I'm reading fantasy. Yeah. James Rollins, it's called the Starless Crown, I think. And it's a fantasy. And he actually dedicated it to Terry Brooks, which is one of the reasons why I picked it up because Terry Brooks was one of the authors that I read when I was a kid. He's from the Pacific Northwest and he wrote a series called Magic Kingdom for Sales, Soul, whatever that was the first book.

in the, the magic kingdom series, but it was about a guy, I think he was an attorney in Seattle or something and he's walking through the woods or, or he like, he, it's like a catalog and, and, there's a magic kingdom for sale. It's like this really exclusive catalog. It's like, yeah, whatever, but I'll buy it. so he buys this magic kingdom has walked into the woods and ends up in this fantasy, you know, this fantastical world. and so growing up in the Seattle area, that was always, you know, really, wow, that's.

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (45:44.494)
awesome, I love it. There's unicorns and there's dragons and there's knights and all this stuff. And so I think I saw that he had, know, his blurb was on the cover of this book and I was like, wow, this is different, you know? So I picked it up. Speaking of Seattle, I'm reading Bob DeGoni's Beyond Reasonable Doubt. He'll be on the show and Bob is a hell of a writer. Yeah, he really is. Yeah.

And it's so funny, I often wonder, sometimes I wish I could be inside my listeners' minds and hear what they would say. That temple man, I don't know, he says the same thing sometimes. Hey, he's a great writer, she's a great writer. And I may say that about a lot of different people. Maybe it's because I hold most authors in very high regard, because it is quite a gift, it is quite a talent. I mean, I write myself, so I know.

the hours it takes to put into it. But it's so fascinating to me and I wish I could tell you how and why, but I can't. How I can pick up one book and I'm just picking Bob DeGoni because I was reading it. I'm reading yours and Bob DeGoni's and one more all simultaneously, cause I'm kind of stacked up here. There's certain things about certain authors that, and this is what I'm getting to.

Finally. The process disappears. The mechanics disappear. You're so pulled into the story. Generally, I'm most attracted to and fond of great characters. If your character is well fleshed out and has real risks that they're going through,

trials and tribulations that trying to overcome. get to see the strength of who they are as a character. I get to see their heart. I'm all in. If you're a cardboard cutout or it's a mechanical devices, you know what I mean by that. I see through it really fast and I have a hard time reading it. And maybe I'm getting more and more this way because we all have less time, right?

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (48:08.046)
So I'm not as willing to spend a lot of time with certain writers anymore. If you, if you, if you're making some of the simple mistakes or you're not giving me great characters, if you're just going through, I'm going to make this shoot them up, bang bang. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, absolutely. I think, it's kind of what I was getting at earlier talking about, you know, the, people that I get to see on a daily basis on my job and in airports and stuff. you realize.

how many different people there are in the world and how many characters there are in the world. And that's, completely agree with you when I'm reading a book, if it's the same Jason Bourne type character, if it's the same, you know, this guy that doesn't have any faults, this guy that has the same fault, you know, it's so cookie cutter, it's so repetitive. And I always try to, in my head, I have this thing where I call it the mini-scratcher on the moped.

and the reason for that is because, I used to live in New Orleans and I used to drive to work through the French quarter every day. And one day I was driving through the French quarter and I saw this woman who was, mean, she looked like a professional. wore, you know, this, this really elegant, like, you know, pencil skirt and she wore like, I mean, she, she was a professional riding the moped.

And you would not expect to see this woman riding a moped through the French quarter in New Orleans. And I thought it was so contrasting. was like, that has to be a character. There has to be a reason. Does she always ride a moped dress like that? Does she only ride the moped to work? So I started asking myself those questions. So when I create characters in my stories, that's what I kind of think of that. Like what makes this person different than the last character I made? What makes them stand out? makes them real?

It's so funny, and you referenced this earlier. One of my favorite places to hang out, oddly enough, is an airport because to me, kind of what you refer to a minute ago, Jack, you're basically looking at a world of characters and all you have to do is see this person and take a piece of it and cross-reference it with this person. know, I used to say that if, if I ever had a

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (50:32.206)
a brain fart or a frozen moment or a writer's block, I'd go to a coffee shop, grab a cup of coffee, ingest some caffeine, and then just sit and listen to conversations and watch people. Maybe not even take my laptop in. And it would do this great little reset. I'm like, ooh, that guy had a really curious way about him. And I overheard some of that conversation. And then I'll take it and I'll weave it into a book. You ever do that?

Absolutely. I used to write a lot in my hotel rooms on overnights. And then I was talking to Mark Graney and he said that he can't do it. He can't write in his hotel rooms. He has to go to a coffee shop. has to go to the lobby. And so that's what I do now. And there is truth to that because even if you're not engaged in conversations, you feel the energy. You so you aren't gonna just sit there and be like, I needed a nap and go climb into bed. So you feel the energy, but also you are seeing

different characters, are seeing interactions, you're getting fed all this information, all this stimulus that can pour into your writing. So yeah, that's what I do now. Here's one of my favorite places to write, and I bet you, you don't do it because you're too busy, is flying. I mean, if I've got, because I fly to the East Coast a lot, three family, five hours, between five and six hours, I'm like, you know how much writing I can get done because you're not going anywhere.

You're not doing anything. I've seen all the movies already. I've read, I don't need to read a book because I read for a living. right. And I do write on airplanes, not while I'm flying them, but a lot of times, no, I don't. While I'm flying, I'm definitely engaged in my job, but my brain is always thinking for sure. But we have these things called deadheads where they need to reposition us to another city to catch a flight. And so we'll be in the back and I always break out my laptop and I always work on,

putting down those words that I've been thinking about all day. What is something that this is such a funny loaded kind of question. What's something about you that your average bear who is who reads your books, knows you were in the military, knows you're a pilot. What's something they don't know about you? my gosh. well, if they don't know about me, they're probably cause I don't want them to know it about me. no, I, I, I am a,

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (52:53.07)
I'm a pretty private person in terms of my family and I have a wife and I have three kids. and, and I, I definitely try to keep them out of the spotlight. but, things that they don't know about me, I'm just going to brag on my kids for a little bit. So, so my, my oldest, son is a freshman at Texas A university. and on his own, he, wanted to go into sports professional sports management.

And so on his own, he got a job with the Texas A football team. And so he's doing that and pursuing a degree in statistics and probably a minor in sports management so that he can, you know, one day work for an NFL team in the front office. So I'm really proud of him and, know, kind of he's taking the bull by the horns and doing that. My other son is a junior in high school. He plays water polo.

like his older brother did, he, that's his passion and he is looking to play in college and we have some interest from schools, including my alma mater of Navy and that's his first choice. So hopefully, you know, that pans out and he can go to the Naval Academy like his old man and play water polo there and maybe even be a pilot.

And that'd be pretty cool. That's a legit sport. You have got to be in shape. Yeah. We, my wife and I travel a lot to obviously all the high school games, but you know, there's tournaments in California, you know, that we go to every summer. and, it's, it's one of my favorite things, favorite pastimes is to go to the water polo games. They're, they're short, they're fast, they're ferocious. mean, it's, it's, it's pretty fun. And then, and then I have a daughter who's in middle school and,

for last couple of years, she was the Texas state beam champion for her level in gymnastics. Is that the one single beam? Yeah, the balance beam. Yeah. So she was the state champion in that and she's continued to do it in 20 hours a week, I think in training. mean, it's something ridiculous. champ. Yeah.

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (55:04.48)
Wow. And what does she want to do with that? Or is this just something she really excelled at in school? Well, she excels at it. I think my wife and I are trying to encourage her to kind of keep going, keep advancing. But she's deciding whether she wants to do that or go into cheerleading and do the high school cheer, which I can also understand. We just really want our kids to have a

a well-rounded childhood experience, things they want to experience, know, freedom to pursue their passions. Of all my kids, my daughter is the most creative one. She likes to draw. She likes to write. She has one of those cricket machines where you can like print labels and stuff. And she does iron on t-shirts and stuff and she's got a little business going. entrepreneurial spirit, creativity. So real proud of her. And obviously with

my travel, my work schedule, you know, if it wasn't for my wife, know, that none of those kids would be half as successful as they are. And I wouldn't be half as successful as I am either. Isn't it amazing? And I hope I say this to Tammy all the time. I think I do. My world is a much better place because of her and if it wasn't for, and women have an ability to multitask.

and find the best in everything and make sure everything is running efficiently. It's just amazing to me how many things she has going. It's the multitasking. Like I remember this when my mother was alive, she had this ability. She could be reading a book or typing something she was always writing or reading. And I'd come in, I'd start a conversation. She'd have the TV on, the radio would be on the background.

And I'd be talking to her, but she didn't seem to be paying attention to me. And she'd be doing all these different things. And I would say, Ma, you didn't even hear me. And she'd stop and turn around and she would spit it out word for word. And I would go, Ma, how do you do that? You were typing and reading a book, TVs on. She goes, that's what a mother does. Yeah. Yeah. They definitely have some skills that I think generally men do not have. This happens between Tammy and I all the time. She'll come in and I'll be...

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (57:25.1)
just like you, be working on something or I'll be editing the show. And she'll come in and start talking to me and, yeah, yeah, okay, yeah. that's great. Yeah, you go ahead and do that. And I'll keep working. She'll come in a few minutes later. She goes, are you going to do that thing that I asked you? I'm like, what are you talking about? Well, I came in here second ago. like, no, I didn't hear you. She goes, but you sat there and I'm like, yeah, but yeah, wasn't there. Yeah, because our brains are focused on whatever that task is.

That's why I think men and women work so well together because, know, we're, we're focused on, you know, the, one task that needs to get accomplished and women are up looking for the threats and the danger and, then they got to smack us right every now and then and say, like, get, looking at that. Look at that. You know, and, that's the biggest bear. Okay. Yeah. I want to make sure that I give plenty of attention to bogey spade. what are you hoping?

that people will take away from this book or is it just, I they enjoy the know, I would say this series in particular, it's the one underlying message that through the whole series is that I want people to realize kind of what threats are out there. So in the first couple of books, like the Chinese intelligence threat is a really pervasive threat.

really everywhere, but in my books, in California. And anybody can pick up the New York Times on any given day and read an article about Chinese espionage in the United States. And a lot of it is here in California. And that's not a knock on California. That's just how pervasive it is. I'm sure we have it in Texas as well. So I wanted to expose that. I wanted people to be able to

walk down the street and not just think like, that's just a normal person. No, that could be a spy. That could be somebody that is trying, you know, to do some, some harm. open their eyes a little bit. It's kind of what the whole series I want, but more than that, it's just an entertaining, entertaining series. I'm not trying to preach to anybody. I'm not trying to beat people over the head and say, vote this way or vote that way. I just want people to enjoy it.

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (59:44.654)
and give them a glimpse into, you know, my life, as a fighter pilot and what I experienced for awhile. so there is a little bit of that in, in bogey spades. it, I, talk about tail hook, the tail hook convention, which, as a fighter pilot and then maybe is, is like the one convention every year where we all meet in Reno and, we get a tell.

tell stories, some of them true, some of them false, you know, about our time when we were landing on aircraft carriers. And, and, and so I talk about that a little bit in the book. I talk about the area, you know, around Reno and Fallon, which is where Top Gun's located. So I'm just kind of give the reader a glimpse more into, you know, what it was like for me in the, in the military. And then the one thing everyone always asks me, in fact, my crew was asking me last night, you know, do I have to read the books in order?

And what I like say is every book is standalone. You could pick up Bogie Spades and enjoy the story from start to finish. But if you had started at book one, you will find things that other people won't know. If you've read the whole series, you'll find little Easter eggs that mean something to you. And I try to do that through all my books so that it does make it a little more meaningful where book three is connected to book one, book four is connected to book two and three, know, so it all kind of blends together.

So I hope they find an entertaining read and I hope that the end of it, they pre-order Declared Hostile, which is book four. And Declared Hostile comes out in August of 2025. Okay. And how many more Battleborns do you, have you thought that far ahead? you? Yeah, I'm contracted to write four. So the fourth one, I, I close pretty much all the story arcs with Declared Hostile. think I tie everything up neatly. I was probably one of my

proudest accomplishments. And so I think it could end. I've really enjoyed writing those characters. I hope that I have an opportunity to write more. Have you heard the conversations that we've had? I had this with Brian Freeman as to the success and or failure of series and the specific number in the series. It seems that, and I may be wrong if I am, go ahead and lambast me on

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (01:02:08.078)
comments, but it seems that part of Amazon's algorithm, I'm going to use that as a general catch-all, likes three book series. I do agree with you. There's a few reasons for it. So let's say I would have had discovered Mark Groene today. Okay. And I pick up his latest Greyman novel and I go, wow, this is number one in a series.

And it's kind of daunting to have to go all the way back to the beginning and read all of them. And again, he's the same way, right? You could read that one book by itself and enjoy it. But if you have the whole catalog behind you, it's more enjoyable. You pick up more, you know more. It's richer. But I could see how that could be daunting as a new reader. And so I do find that like Thomas and Mercer and Amazon Publishing Company, they...

we'll do like three book series. And then they asked their writers to move on to another one and another one and another one. And that's, think is a pretty good business model from the standpoint of, you can get somebody on, let's say your third series. They discover you. Well, they can read that three book series. what else does he have? He has these other three books here. I can read this three book series. It's not as daunting, you know, might still be the same number of books, but you know, I think that's the word in it. Yeah.

Yeah, I think it seems daunting and talking to a few of my friends who are with that publisher and they find that every new series kind of they see an increase. There's some buzz around a new series and so they see an increase in sales and so from a marketing perspective and from a sales perspective it probably makes sense. You know, every once in a while on this show I have my guests

rapid fire question me or drill down on questions they've always wondered about the show. I'm not looking for any attention, but because we've become such good friends and you catch a lot of the show, I know you're a fan. Is there anything that you have ever while you're driving or working out or running or whatever that you listening to the show and you go, man, one of these days I'm gonna ask Dave this. Yeah, I wanna know when you have time to write. I know how much production goes into

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (01:04:26.232)
to these interviews and how much emphasis goes into the show, but I know you're a writer first and I know that you have projects. When do you have time with all this going on to take care of David Temple? Thank you for asking. As you know, this cancer has, the prostate cancer that I had, the surgery was a success and then it was aggressive. So it came back and then I went through radiation hormone.

And I was very cavalier at the beginning because I was like, man, I don't know what they're talking about radiation, shmadiation. mean, you know, hormone therapy, whatever. But it, kept hearing this word cumulative and I'm getting to your point. The accumulative effects have really sucker punched me in these last couple of months. And I realized I was working so hard through summer by putting out an episode a week easy. And it has really kicked me in the balls to be honest with you. Yeah. And,

And Tammy just asked me two nights ago, she goes, when are you going to pump the brakes? She goes, I haven't seen you writing lately. And I'm like, oops. And she goes, you know, I used to see you disappear when we, when we met and I moved to New York city and we lived in Midtown. I get up every day at six o'clock. We'd say goodbye to each other at seven o'clock. She'd go to dwell magazine and I would go down and pick a different coffee shop to write. And for an entire year, that's all I did.

And I realized how much I love that. So to your point, it is hard. And I think part of what's going to happen here, like happening now is I'm backing off some more. just, can't keep this level up right now for energy wise. Plus I really miss writing and I've got this nonfiction book on prostate cancer journey. And then I've got this thriller.

that I have been noodling on in the back of my head. That's a long way of saying, I have to either get up at, I've been getting up around four with the, well, we got a new puppy. So somewhere between four and six, I'll try to bang out some writing before I get prepared for the day. Cause most of my interviews happen this 10, 11 o'clock. But yeah, I'm.

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (01:06:40.814)
It's, been a challenge and it's, it's, I think it's going to back off just a little bit. I just so love what I do and I love hanging out with guys like you and just talking about this stuff. And this face to face, as you've heard me say before, is just, it doesn't get any better. does not. No. And, and, people will go, but this is almost as good as zoom. And I'm like, it's nowhere near zoom. Yeah. Yeah. But, know, and you know, the reason I love coming here and having this face to face is because like I do consider you a friend and just like,

know, a couple of weeks ago when I was in town and we had brunch, mean, that's, that's the important part. I, we can keep talking this stuff, whether we have a camera on us or not, you know, and it'd be really cool to one day sit down and tell me about your book. Tell me about the one that's coming out. You know, well, and you know, I realized Tammy asked me this too. goes, you know, do your listeners know of any of your books? I'm like, you know, I don't know. I'm like,

where I have really dropped the ball. And Ryan Steck and I were talking about this the other day, because he said, you know, we were both commiserating about the fact that we drive this machine so much that people don't even know that we write. Right. And I said, yeah, I need to get back to that and talk about my books. Wait a minute. We're getting we're getting interrupted by my beautiful wife, so you know which. Hi. She's coming in for the hug. How you doing? How are you?

Yeah, I'm doing great. So good to see you. to see you. You guys having fun? Yeah. Yeah. We're having a great time. Yeah, we're writing giving them our time, but not writing it off. Yeah. Yes, I am aligned with you on that. Yeah. Yeah. It's so nice to see you come down. We were just talking about you. I just had to see you. didn't want to miss you. Good to see you. And I hope everything's going great. Everything's going well. David's keeping me in the loop on you. Hi, darling. Hi. I love you. I love you. All right. You guys have fun. Thank you. Good seeing you.

So glad you came by. There walks my voice of reason because we all need them. She said to me, she has said to me a number of times, she goes, you know, that is when we very first met, and this is, this is a perfect point for this. I just moved to Manhattan and she said, let me ask you something, honey. If you could take just this next year and do anything in the world. I'm like, write a book.

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (01:08:58.956)
And that's when I sat down and wrote a book. That's the first time I committed an entire year to do nothing but. And when you have that freedom. Yeah. I think that there are a lot of people, I talked to a lot of people in my profession and there's a lot of people who, I was wanting to write a book one day or, know, and that was me, right? At one point that was me saying one day I'll write a book. Yeah. One day I'll write a book. And it really just takes a commitment to say today's that day. Yeah.

And the other thing that we were talking about stuff is daunting for me, writing a book was daunting. You know, it was how am I going to finish this book? And to some degree, every book I write when I first start on word one page one, it's like, here we go. I hope I can reach the end, you know? And then of course you get into the story and it starts to flow naturally. And the minute you finish one book, you realize it's really not that daunting. It's really, there's a process. But the one thing I want to say to people that

You have always wanted to write a book is take the time to do it, but don't be your own worst enemy. Don't stand in your own way. I think so many people, it has to be perfect and they keep going back and they keep revising and they keep editing it and it can always be improved. Every single book can always be improved. You have to at some point say, this is it, I'm done. I'm going to put it out there and see if people like it.

and you learn from it, then move on to something else. But you see a lot of people that will have that one good idea, that one good book that they'll work on and like keep tweaking it over and over and over again and not have any success with it. And those are the ones that ultimately don't become successful authors. That analysis paralysis. have so many friends. my gosh. They would write a book, then they would rewrite it. And then they'd like give it to friends.

and the friends that give notes and they rewrite it again. And I have this one friend who I will not mention. He has rewritten this book so many times. I'm like, dude, just let it go. There's plenty more ideas out And if you only have one idea, maybe a profession of being a writer is not for you and that's okay. And maybe just be okay with the fact that you should, you've accomplished something that not many people have. You've finished a book.

The Thriller Zone with David Temple (01:11:17.87)
Well, you know, it's funny, I always close every show with your best writing advice, and I think that's what you just gave me. There it is. There it is. JackStewartBooks.com if you want to learn more. And of course, Bogie Spades is the latest Battle Born thriller. And as always... It's a pleasure, my friend. Pleasure is mine.